About ‘Hard Fork’, a critical look at the future of technology
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After recording about 90 episodes of “Hard Fork,” a weekly New York Times podcast about technology and business, life is largely the same for hosts Kevin Roose and Casey Newton. That is, aside from the occasional fan encounter, which is a new and sometimes surprising experience for them.
“Just last night, I was having dinner with two friends who were visiting from out of town,” Mr. Newton said. “As I was coming back from the bathroom, I was stopped by a man. At first I thought I had met him before, because I am basically face blind. But then it turns out he recognized me from our YouTube channel.”
Since the podcast’s first episode in October 2022, Mr. Roose and Mr. Newton have discussed and debated topics including the looming TikTok ban by U.S. lawmakers, Elon Musk’s acquisition of Twitter, and the pros and cons of digital companionship. They have interviewed guests such as Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and Sam Altman, a co-founder of OpenAI.
Along the way, Mr. Roose and Mr. Newton have experimented with the podcast format, inviting listeners to submit their questions, for example. But their mission has remained the same: to inform and entertain.
In an interview, Mr. Newton and Mr. Roose shared their goals for the future of the podcast and their dream guests. These are edited excerpts.
How did you meet?
CASEY NEWTON My memory of meeting Kevin for the first time was that I was invited to a party for his book, “Young Money,” at the home of Evelyn Rusli, a former reporter for the Times. I remember walking in and being so irritated that he was younger than me and was already on his second book. I don’t even remember meeting him. I’m sure I said hello. I kept running into Kevin over the years and we developed a friendship.
KEVIN ROOS I was a subscriber and huge fan of Casey’s newsletter, Platformer, which is a must-read here in Silicon Valley. Platformer is really good and also pretty serious, covering topics like content moderation and tech law. I also knew there was another side to Casey. I knew he’d done improv comedy. I knew he was really funny and sharp and quick-thinking and that it was just really fun to talk to him about this stuff. So I wondered, “Can the person who writes this very important, very serious newsletter also be my podcast co-host?”
“Hard Fork” is almost two years old. What has the feedback been from listeners so far?
NEWTON The typical email says that we use the word “like” too much, that there are too many “ums”, that there is too much gibberish. They ask why we talk about artificial intelligence so much.
ROSE Casey is sandbagging. We get some of the best feedback of any project I’ve ever worked on in my career as a journalist. We hear from a lot of people who have really good, smart ideas. It’s very humbling to work on a show where your listeners are smarter than you and have a Ph.D. in molecular biology or are AI researchers.
What is the biggest challenge in making the podcast?
NEWTON Besides Kevin’s personality? The hardest part is that sometimes there aren’t three things I want to talk about in an episode. There are a lot of tech shows that have this consensus by committee, like, “Here are the three most important stories of the week, and we’re going to talk about them no matter what, even if we don’t feel like we have a strong position.” Kevin and I really try not to do that. We try to lead the podcast where our own curiosity goes and only talk about things that we have something to say about.
What are your goals for the future of “Hard Fork”?
NEWTON I want to make sure that the show is surprising and inventive. One of my original thoughts for Hard Fork was that it should feel like The Price Is Right in terms of games and segments. You never know what segments or games are going to come out in a given week. Right now, we’re coming up with ideas for other types of segments that will go along with the show that fit with what we do and also allow us to explore more creatively. We want to grow the audience. We want to be the biggest tech show in the world.
ROSE I want to be the biggest show in the world, not just a tech show. I want Joe Rogan to kneel for us. That’s my goal.
Who is your dream guest?
NEWTON It’s interesting because so many of the big names don’t end up being great interviews. But I will say that Sarah Jessica Parker responded to me on Threads and said she was a fan of the show. If we could get her on the show, that would be a dream.
ROSE When we started the show, we actually had a big list of dream guests. I looked at it recently and we interviewed a lot of them, so I’m really happy about that. I would love to be invited to do a ketamine bender with Elon Musk and interview him under the influence.
What do you like most about working together?
NEWTON Kevin was really the only person I wanted to do a podcast with. There’s something about the way he talks that just resonates with me. Kevin and I agree on a surprising number of things. Even though we sometimes have different perspectives on issues, we see the world the same way. So it’s nice to get in the studio with him.
ROSE That’s the nicest thing you’ve ever said to me.
NEWTON Okay, don’t use all that.
ROSE Casey is a great journalist and a great friend. He’s the funniest person I know and he has an unusually strong moral compass. It’s really impressive to me how Casey hasn’t abandoned his ethical core in the pursuit of journalistic excellence. He’s still really driven by principle. I’m not going to say that’s rare, because a lot of journalists are, but I think he’s a particularly strong example of that.
